[While the Indonesian government seems to be making progress in Aceh, moderate Muslims say President Megawati's denying them a role in determining the place of Islam in the country's political life. Nahdlatul Ulama, the moderate Islamic group previoulsy headed by former President Wahid feels it's being sidelined because of the poor relationship between Gus Dur and President Megawati, his former deputy. NU claims a membership of 40-million and has strongly opposed legislation – at both the regional and national levels, to introduce the conservative islamic Sharia law.]

Presenter/Interviewer: Karon Snowdon

Speakers: Mohammad Fajrul Falaahk, deputy Chairman of Indonesia's largest Muslim group, Nahdlatul Ulama, Vice Dean of Gadja Mada University Law School and a member of Indonesia's National Law Commission

Falaahk: The military has more influence of her administration and many of these moderate Islamic organisations have also been critical of the military. So, including more moderate Islam it means a threat to the military who has had more influence on her administration.

Snowdon: So there's some major issues there that need to be dealt with at the top political level before Indonesia will move forward in its democracy?

Falaahk: She has to choose, she has to choose. I mean going forward together even with Islamic elements to democratise the country or being trapped with a military who has experience in the past 30 to 40 years of supporting an authoritarian regime.

Snowdon: Has President Megawati acted strongly enough in relation to Bali and other terrorist attacks within Indonesia?

Falaahk: She's not that clear enough. So for instance, right after the Bali bombing, two organisations, my organisation – Nahdlatul Ulama – then the Muhammadiyah, expressly condemned the Bali bombing, calling it an uncivilised act of terrorism. But she did not really make a clear response as to what she would want to do. She's really unclear about how to deal with Islam and I mean that's important because this is a predominantly Islamic country. So this is very political and practical, to garner political support from the wider population then you have to deal with many parties.

Snowdon: You've said that President Megawati has been somewhat ambivalent in her approach to things like the Bali bombing, perhaps in more general terms to the very radical rhetoric that's been coming out of Indonesia for some time from groups and people like Abu Bakar Bashir. Could the same be said of groups such as NU, such as your organisation? Has NU spoken out enough?

Falaahk: Oh yes, I mean you can enquire from the Union of Churches in Indonesia, from the Catholic bishop there and the Hindus or the Buddhist leaders, how an organisation like NU has been involved in the past ten years with minorities.

Snowdon: How can the relationship at the very top political level between Indonesia and Australia be improved, what will it take, assuming it needs improvement of course?

Falaahk: Of course I think this is a long, long issue.

Snowdon: Because ultimately it frames, doesn't it, much of the relationship between the two countries more generally?

Falaahk: Yeah, but this is some more exclusively elite political communication.

Snowdon: So it's very dependent on the individuals involved?

Falaahk: On the leaders, especially with regard to foreign relations.

Snowdon: How do we better understand Indonesia then, given in general the misunderstanding and fear of Islam that seems to be growing in Australia?

Falaahk: First less knowledge about your neighbour is a crucial source from which prejudices and misunderstanding could emerge. So I mean both societies, Indonesia and also the Australian public have to increase their knowledge. But as long as you have a willingness to increase your knowledge, trying to understand your neighbour then soon you were get along with your neighbour. Otherwise even if your neighbour comes from the same village you might not be able to have a good relationship.