United Nations Special Representative for Human Rights Affairs, Hina Jilani, listened intently to the comments of the speakers who converged at Goethe Haus in Jakarta on Thursday, two weeks ago. Filling the auditorium were scores of activists, both foreign and Indonesian.

That day, they had come to attend the public hearing and to convey their reports to Jilani. Speakers were given five minutes each, and if they went beyond the time limit, they would find their microphone turned off.

One by one, they told their stories of terror, threats, land grabbing, sexual harassment, the murder of human rights activist Munir and violence towards journalists. Sticking to her own strict rule, Jilani never reacted to the reports. "I am here to listen to your reports, not to make comments," she said.

Violence has been an inseparable part of the life journey of Jilani, the 54-year-old lady from Lahore, Pakistan. In her youth, she witnessed her politician father defend the rights of minorities, being dragged to prison because of his refusal to compromise with the authorities.

Ever since her young days, Jilani has devoted herself to human rights activities. As a lawyer, she dedicated her time to defending the rights of women. "The women in my country go through incredible legal discrimination," she said in an October 1999 interview with Human Rights magazine.

Jilani has visited prisons to observe how inmates are treated. Against all odds, she established the Human Rights Commission and Legal Aid Center in her country. Going in and out of prison, threats to her life became a daily occurrence. However, her determination won her quite a few international awards. She also attracted the attention of former UN Secretary-General Kofi Annan, who offered her the job as the UN's Special Representative for Human Rights Affairs, based in Geneva, Switzerland.

In her new position, she succeeded in convincing the UN Human Rights Commission to issue a resolution against the Government of Colombia. According to Jilani, the government's treatment towards human rights defenders there had gone beyond tolerance. The Colombian government complied with the resolution and agreed to draft a bill to protect human rights workers.

In the case of Indonesia, Jilani's patience was truly tested. She had sent as many as 35 letters in the past six years to have the government invite her to Indonesia. The invitation came just a year ago. Jilani was here recently for two weeks to observe the human rights situation in the country, specifically in Aceh and Papua. "Papua is beautiful, Aceh is interesting and the situation is very similar to that in my own country," she said.

Jilani met with a number of officials and human rights activists. She traveled to Aceh and Papua. She also wanted to meet with President Susilo Bambang Yudhoyono, but she failed to do so. "The President's schedule was tight and he was unable to meet her," presidential spokesman Andi Mallarangeng told Tempo last Friday, "but the President made sure that Ibu Jilani be given access to ministers and government officials."

Before flying to Papua, Jilani spared some time to meet with Tempo reporters Maria Hasugian, Abdul Manan, Wahyu Dhyatmika and Dimas Aryo for a special interview. The interview was resumed last Tuesday, a few hours before she flew back to Geneva. Excerpts:

What made you decide to come to Indonesia?

Indonesia's role is very important and significant in Asia. I visited Thailand, then I came to Indonesia. I am very interested in finding out how the reforms are proceeding here. I would like to see how changes in government policies have affected the human rights situation after 1998 (the start of reforms-Ed.). I would like to see how conditions are affecting human rights workers.

We have a serious case-the murder of Munir, a human rights activist. How do you see this case?

There are strong indications that a human rights defender was assassinated. I see the Munir case as being very important to Indonesia. I discussed this during my early meetings with government officials. I stressed the hope that the case will soon be resolved and the perpetrators punished. The government must demonstrate its goodwill to protecting human rights defenders.

Munir's widow, Suciwati, has asked for the UN's help. What do you suggest?

We don't think we need to issue any resolution about this. We have asked the government's serious commitment in resolving this case.

Do you see the government seriously resolving the Munir case?

So far, I see that the government is trying to resolve the case.

What is the UN's assessment of the Indonesian government's effort to resolve this case?

I can only say that there will certainly be demands on the part of the human rights defenders in the case. And I will emphasize that special attention should be given to past and present investigations. I hope there will be new developments in the case and that the government will seriously attempt to resolve the case. I regard every serious case as a milestone. The government must be willing to protect human rights defenders.

You visited Papua and Aceh. What reports did you receive from those two provinces?

Well, the two areas are very important because I had received information from 99 human rights activists, mostly from Aceh and Papua. These two provinces have been my priorities during this visit.

Can you explain your findings in more detail?

Before going to Aceh about six years ago, I had communicated 35 times with the government regarding the human rights situation in that area. I had received information regarding human rights defenders being killed, disappearing, being intimidated, threatened, harassed and even terrorized because they were working in a conflict situation. Yet, what they were doing was protecting civilians from the effects of the conflict.

What did you see during your visit to Aceh this time?

Well, the situation in Aceh has remarkably improved.

Have the human rights cases reported to you from Aceh been resolved?

Not yet. That is a problem and it has become my concern. There has been no effort on the government's part to solve these human rights cases of the past. I am very concerned, particularly regarding cases I reported to the government but which I have yet to hear of the outcomes.

What were most of the cases reported by human rights defenders in Papua?

In Papua, most reports from human rights defenders were about violations of freedom of opinion and expression. Generally, they were threatened when investigating cases of violence by the military or intelligence forces. Most of the cases involve arbitrary detentions, harassment, threats and some violence. But so far, there have been no reports on missing people or killings. Nevertheless, I believe that [disappearances and killings] are happening in certain cases.

So, what did you get from your visit to Papua?

I think the situation in Papua is very serious. The difficult environment and the political conflict there make it very difficult for human rights defenders to do their job. The military and the police still conduct their security operations. The human rights defenders face great difficulties when they not only prevent violations, also when they report violations. The effort to monitor and report has become a big problem for them. This situation is still going on there.

What do you conclude from these cases?

I see a certain pattern from the cases that I have seen. So, I must speak out to ensure that immediate investigation is carried out. I have reported this to the government and I will wait for their response. I have verified the sources that provided me with the reports, hence I am able to make such a conclusion.

Are you ever concerned that your findings will be rejected by the government?

I don't think so. We understand each other. Furthermore, the Indonesian government, as a member of the United Nations, must accept and understand that it's our responsibility to clarify questions.

How did the government officials react to your report of the situation in Papua?

The government was quite open. In certain cases, there was a gap on how the government protected the human rights defenders. But I asked the government to accept my report. I also expressed the hope that this gap can be closed or bridged with the human rights defenders in Papua.

Which officials have you met with?

I met with many senior officials, ministers and military officers. They were quite open and cooperative in facilitating all meetings, including my meetings with human rights workers. Thus far, I have not seen the government trying to interfere in any of my meetings.

But you failed to meet with President Susilo Bambang Yudhoyono?

Yes, I did not get the opportunity to meet him, although my main objective was to meet the President. I had hoped the ministers I met could have told him of my wish to see him.

You also met with the chief of the State Intelligence Agency (BIN)...

Unfortunately not. They arranged for me to meet with the Coordinating Minister for Political & Security Affairs at the start of my visit. I also met with the Chief of Staff of the Army. He was quite open to my remarks, and said he would consider my recommendations. I hope those recommendations will be implemented on the ground too.

How do you expect such recommendations to be issued?

As a matter of procedure, we submit our report to the government for its response. Then I submit it to the UN Human Rights Council. An official recommendation will then be issued and the government will be requested to follow up on them. Of course we will be careful so that the recommendations can be implemented by the government. I will make specific recommendations, and I will make sure they will lead to concrete changes.

What will go in your recommendations?

Among others, the need for better coordination between the human rights agencies. They are responsible for taking the proper steps to improve their coordinating system. I will make suggestions to facilitate their improvement. But there is also a need to build the capacity of institutions, so that their functions become more credible. The National Commission for Human Rights (Komnas Ham) is one example. I feel that Komnas Ham must be improved and its capacity and network must be upgraded, as well as the coordination between the Jakarta central office and the regional branch offices.

If the government fails to implement the UN recommendations, what will be the consequence to Indonesia?

I always try to push governments into seriously considering the recommendations. And I hope that the UN Human Rights Council will also be consistent in implementing its procedures so that there will be an impact on the governments that implement those recommendations.