The Indonesian military has begun selling off some of its business ventures as part of government reforms. The defence minister has given the green light to the sale of some assets a month before they're due to be taken over by the state.

MacGregor: As part of reforms promised by the president, hundreds of businesses owned or part-owned by the military will be taken over or closed down by the state over the next five years.

With legislation due to come into effect in the next few weeks time, the military has already begun selling some of its assets. That's angered some members of parliament, who say the businesses should not be transferred until the law is enacted. Indonesian military expert Professor Salim Said agrees the process is still unclear.

Said: I mean it's still being decided what the government's going to do with that business and also where the government can get the money to compensate the military.

MacGregor: In the past, the Indonesian government has provided less than half of the military budget. And while some say the business ventures could be worth as much as 2 billion dollars, Salim Said believes there won't be enough to fund the shortfall.

Said: The amount of the money generated from the business of the military is not enough to cover the budget of the military. So the government, in order to professionalise the military – in the sense of equip them, pay them properly, stop them doing business – they need to have enough money for that.

MacGregor: Well, how much are the defence force being paid now? Are they being paid enough?

Said: I think they are very much underpaid, just like the bureaucracy. The Indonesian bureaucracy, Indonesian military are very much underpaid.

MacGregor: What would it cost to fund an effective and professional defence force?

Said: Well, I really don't know exactly how much money do we need. But what I heard is that up until now, only around 50 percent of the budget requested by the military can be provided by the state, by the government. So we still need a lot of money to professionalise our armed forces.

MacGregor: Will the defence force in future be a much smaller and leaner organisation?

Said: There are many people talking in Indonesia that such a big country with such a big population, we need more military to protect the country. So there is a debate going on on this, whether to have a smaller armed forces or even larger armed forces than what we have now.

I think we have to review the whole setup. For instance, do we need such a big army, with a small air force, small navy? Probably we need more navy and more air force, and probably we have enough army now.

MacGregor: While the government tries to answer these questions, Salim Said says the military is continuing to influence political debate.

Said: This discussion, the discussion on this is not politically free.

MacGregor: Are elements of the military resisting this asset sale?

Said: Well, I don't think they have resistance on that. But the government's ability is very limited. And also because the political condition is not yet horrible enough to push the reformation of the military and to talk about what kind, how big the military we should have in this country.