The former head of Indonesia's national human rights commission says the agency's independence is under threat because of recent legislative changes. Asmara Nababan was a founding member of the commission and served as its General Secretary from 1999 until last year. He resigned after the parliament passed new laws which fundamentally changed the operation of the commission and its relationship to government.

Presenter/Interviewer: Peter Mares

Speakers: Asmara Nababan, ex-General Secretary Indonesia's Human Rights Commission

Mares: In 1993, when the dictator Suharto set up Indonesia's national human rights commission, few observers expected it to be anything other than a paper tiger. Yet the commission proved to be rather more than that. Despite its limited powers in relation to the government and the military, and despite the failure of Indonesia's courts to pursue the cases it raised, the Human Rights Commission was at least able to bring human rights abuses to light, and put the details on the public record.

Since the fall of Suharto in 1998, the Commission has helped to ensure that human rights is very much part of public debate, according to its former General Secretary, Asmara Nababan.

Asmara Nababan: It's more open .... arguments anymore. meaning that the people become aware of their rights, the fundamental rights.

Mares: Despite this much improved climate, and Indonesia's transition to democracy, Asmara Nababan, fears for the future independence of the Human Rights Commission. Earlier this month President Megawati met with new members of the commission appointed last year – but according to Asmara Nababan the real test of government's attitude to the Commission will come when it deals with cases that implicate the military.

Asmara Nababan: If the government support the work of the commission ... did not really support the commission .... personnels or generals.

Mares: Asmara Nababan resigned from the Human Rights Commission in October last year. He says part of his reason for stepping down was that new regulations came into force that would have required him, or anyone else in the post of General Secretary, to become a civil servant, directly employed by the Indonesian government.

Asmara Nababan: There is a lot of new arrangements which I believe can affect the independence of these commissions.

Mares: As well as making the General Secretary a civil servant, the new regulations also meant that all staff members employed by the Commission also became government employees. In the past, the commission employed its own staff, outside of government ranks, with their own salary structure. Asmara Nababan fears that poorly paid public servants will be much more open to corruption, and to intimidation by senior government officials.

Asmara Nababan: All the staff, which actually do the job the wors of the commission must be civil servants.

Mares: All the investigators and staff, that sort of thing?

Nababan : Thats right. The commission only makes the policy, controlling and evaluation, but the staff do the jobs works investigations research and so on, they are not independent, because as civil servants they have to obey the government regulations, they have to see their career, they don't want to make trouble with the government. Otherwise they will jeopardise their positions.

Mares: Asmara Nababan is also concerned by the size of Indonesia's national human rights commission – orginally there were twenty five commissioners, now there are 35 – he thinks somewhere between five and eight commissioners would be much more efficient.

Asmara Nababan: It's too big. It's difficult to get decisions. It takes time to discuss a simple matter to be agreed by all of the members. It makes the commission slow and work and response to the needs of the people.

Mares: Asmara Nababan says current commissioners are again pushing for a change to the legislation governing its operation – otherwise he says, its independence will be compromised.

Asmara Nababan: If they don't deliver something they will loose the trust of the peoples. The commission needs the trust of the peoples.